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Re: [BKARTS] what's happened to this group?



Since we on this list number 3000 or more and represent countries around the world, I don't think the 12 or so people who posted in this latest thread represent any sort of majority. There is and has always been a tendency to jump off the edge, speak before thinking, assume where assumption is perhaps arrogance at best. And that is all too human. Had Michael approached with more tact and awareness of the dynamics of this group, perhaps the response would have been different. Perhaps not. This kind of discussion has happened before, and it's always sad when discourse slides into discourtesy. But it is equally sad when responses are made without thinking (and rethinking).

It's always a good idea to read through one's copy before sending. Then to reread it. And to reread it yet again, always keeping in mind the vagaries of language and meaning. Then hit send, or don't send it at all. Civil discourse is first of all, civil.

Carol
Eugene, OR

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On Apr 13, 2009, at 8:01 PM, Natalie Bennett wrote:

Jet - It is being the discussion group it has always been: heterogeneous in
all kinds of ways, pretty conservative in others. Every question/ query
triggers a battery of responses from those who feel most invested or
motivated to respond at that moment. Most people don't bother to respond at
all (Michael, you are clearly pissed off, but no, I can't say that you are
right to claim that most of the group is so and so; how can anybody know
that, really?) After this squall dies down, it will be back to the usual,
until the next squall. I'm fairly new to the list, and I can honestly say
that even some of the responses to technical questions were pretty
fascinating for how they well they conveyed the absoluteness and rigidity of
some persons' ideas about bookmaking. If I ever thought bookbinders and book
artists were all radical constructionists - which I didn't - I would have
been seriously disabused of that idea by now. We are who we are, no matter
what we call the curve, fall, throwup, whatever. And we can and will still
learn a lot about making books on here, even with a heavy-handed dose of
positivism.


Natalie



On Mon, Apr 13, 2009 at 8:38 PM, Jet Foncannon <bolu.bolu@xxxxxxxxxxx>wrote:

What has happened to this discussion group?
One of the qualities in the discussions that appealed to me when I first
subscribed was the attitude of congeniality that prevailed, the willingness
to share experiences, master to tyro, that made reading the submissions to
the list such a pleasure. For instance, early on I complained about my
inability to successfully edge gild books. I had purchased all the necessary
equipment and yet turned out one failure after another. I complained to this
group, and a very experienced binder who lived in Florida gave me his
telephone number and suggested I call him. I did. He asked me to go to my
workshop and he walked me through the process. He must have spent two hours
with me on the phone. As a result I can now gild books successfully, and I
am very grateful for his generosity.
This love of the craft and the excited and generous sharing of knowledge is
what for me made this discussion group unique. So much of my craft I owe to
the experience of the members of this group.
It was with alarm and sadness that I read some of the replies to the e-mail
of Michael Carrosone. It was obvious to me that he is finding his way in the
worlds of academia and research, and should have been treated with
sensitivity and common courtesy. Instead, he was greeted with patronising
lectures on the scientific method; his motives and competence, and even that
of his supervisor, were arrogantly called into question. Not just one
letter, but letter after letter after letter. The worthlessness of his
undertaking and the fatuousness of his political and aesthetic views was
detailed again and again.
I can only imagine my reaction when I first joined this discussion group
had someone scorned my idiocy because I couldn’t perform the simple task of
edge gilding a book.
I confess some of my e-mails to this group have been tinged with asperity,
for instance, when encountering what I see as the chemophobia of some of
those engaged in book crafts. Michael’s experience has forced me to confront
some of my own failings in this regard.
I now ask myself a simple questions: would I be able to communicate to the
recipient of an e-mail to this group the contents of the e-mail if I were
face to face with that person?
If not, I have forgotten the spirit of collegiality that for me is such an
priceless
ingredient of our discussions.



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Walk good and good will follow you.



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            and are automatically removed by the listserver.

For all your subscription questions, go to the Book_Arts-L FAQ and Archive.
See <http://www.philobiblon.com> for full information.


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***********************************************
Please note that attachments to listserv messages are not permitted,
and are automatically removed by the listserver.
For all your subscription questions, go to the Book_Arts-L FAQ and Archive.
See <http://www.philobiblon.com> for full information.
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